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Tuesday, December 13, 2005

Conversation With A Liberal- Iraq

More conversation with a Liberal:

Liberal (this is a lawyer in his mid-50's):

the beacon of freedom effort has resulted in at least 30,000 Iraqi citizens killed- President Murtha had it right when he said we've got to pull back to slow down the killing-- your pal Howard Stern wants to bring back Saddam so order can be restored amidst the chaos created by our "occupation."
Yugoslavia as I recall had a democratic socialist system for awhile (workers running the factory sharing the profits) that was quite successful- no need to go back to the stone age-we're developing hybrids and willie nelson has that ethanol stuff


My reply:

The "order" that you readily trade for freedom is fortunately not appreciated by a large majority of Iraqis. The order you approved of that existed behind the Iron Curtain was not appreciated by the millions who had to live under totalitarian "order" for 70 years.

As a Jew, I wish I could have traded in 1 million Jewish lives (now that is a big number to throw at someone) to have saved the remaining 5 million who died in the ravages of "order" that you uphold. And I am thankful for the disorder wrought on Europe by the Allies who saved the remaining Jews and others from the order of socialism. Yes, it was a military intervention that stopped the extermination machine. Yes, it was military intervention that stopped slavery in America. Maybe the order of the slavery culture could have remained for another century. I am glad it was ended by the Northern white military venture that cost the most American lives in history.

As you tend to view economic issues, so are you flawed in your view of this military action. This is not zero-sum. The number of Iraqis who vote in the election in the next few days (and some of them will be killed by the terrorists you treat as freedom fighters) attests to the will of people to overcome the order you so fervently support. The "occupation" will cease in a few years most likely. The resulting order of democracy will be something Iraqis will honor.

The Liberal responds:

80 percent of the Iraqis want us out now- my biggest beef aside from the "inaccuracies about weapons of mass destruction, nuclear weapons and the smears of wilson and his wife is the Pres's assurances we would be treated as heroes and that everything would be hunky dory once Saddam was toppled- a fantasy that has led to the deaths of over 2,000 servicemen and over 30,000 Iraqi citizens-- plus our "torture" track record (including deaths of prisoners) has made recruiting for terrorists easier not harder-- also the shiiite majority in Iraq is tight with Iran, where the Iranian Pres there once again said the holocaust never happened-- I'm having trouble seeing "victory" now or in the future-- I believer Murtha's view is there is a civil war between sunni's and shiites, being fueled by our presence-- of course the american people are way ahead of most of the republican and democratic supporters of "stay the course" as evidenced by the polls-- I'm still betting we will reduce our presence their prior to the 2006 elections- if some sort of semi-stable democracy is established there, fine- the shiite majority wants an Islamic democracy, which has the potential to spell more trouble for the US and Israel.

3 Comments:

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